OPEN GAME THREAD: IPFW at WSU
by Jeff Nusser on Nov 19, 2009 7:00 PM PST
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PrintIPFW Mastodons at Washington St. Cougars, Nov 19, 2009 7:00 PM PST
PROBABLE STARTERS
| WSU (*used redsirt) | Vitals | IPFW | Vitals | |||
| G | Reggie Moore (Fr.) | 6-1/178 | G | Ben Botts (Jr.) |
6-0/170 |
|
| G | Klay Thompson (So.) | 6-6/200 | G | Nick Daniels (Sr.) |
6-2/200 | |
| G | Marcus Capers (So.) | 6-4/180 | G | Zach Plackemeier | 6-3/190 |
|
| F | Abe Lodwick (So.*) | 6-7/200 | F | Antwone Snead (Jr.) |
6-5/220 |
|
| F | DeAngelo Casto (So.) | 6-8/231 | F | Deilvez Yearby (Sr.) |
6-6/215 |
Running kind of short on time, so I'll go ahead and point out the obvious: This is a game the Cougs should dominate at the end of their three game extended preseason to open the year before heading to Alaska. The Mastodons (fun fact: a mastodon is an extinct elephant-like mammal that flourished worldwide from Miocene through Pleistocene times) are small up front, which ought to buy Ken Bone some more time to sort out the frontcourt.
The Mastodons (I just like typing that) are coached by Dane Fife. Yes, that Dane Fife.
Some things to watch:
Deilvez Yearby, IPFW: The Mastodons most experienced player, one can assume the offense runs through him. He scored 20 in the opener against Wisconsin, the lone bright spot in that blowout of a game. (The Mastodons' eFG% in that game was 37.2 percent. Yeow.)
Jeremy Mixon, IPFW: He comes off the bench, but the sophomore guard looks like IPFW's most dangerous scorer. He's second on the team at 15.5 points per game.
The WSU big men: With a distinct size advantage (probably one of the two times we'll be able to say that this year), will the frontcourt begin to get sorted out? Will James Watson get some run? Will Brock Motum make an appearance? And if they do, will they do anything special?
Ken Bone's rotation: He admitted after last game that he played some guys too long (Thompson, Casto and Moore). How does he try to distribute the minutes tonight in what's likely to be a blowout?
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Everybody say it with me....it's early
Cal got blown out by a good Syracuse team, 95-73.
Also, woooo basketball season
Never a good sign when Syracuse beats you this early
Especially when you’re the much more experienced team.
A friend of mine's a Syracus alum
He said that’s the best he’s seen them play since Carmelo was on campus. They pretty much throttled Cal, and it probably wouldn’t have mattered if those guys had played.
They're definitely talented
I’ll believe it when I see some consistency. That’s always the issue with Syracuse.
If they could play every game like it's a Big East tournament game
They always seem to turn it on then
Also helps that the game was at MSG, their second home.
At one point they had like a 13-0 advantage at the line.
anyone else think biology labs should be canceled on game days? me too
by spencer peaty on Nov 19, 2009 7:08 PM PST via mobile reply actions
Curious...
If Abe makes threes in practice. They still let him fire away so he must.
Well, we're gonna get someone else in at the 4 spot
Lodwick has 2. I’d guess Watson, Nik, and (hopefully) Motum get in on it.
i feel like klay is going to have
morrison like improvement year to year….which may not be good in keeping him until he is a senior.
Lots of ifs
And a long way from now….but just think how good this team could be in two years.
Tom Glasgow and Lenny Wilkens on the Seattle U call
Totally off topic, but interesting. As an aside, does anyone have any idea why Joe Callero left for Cal Poly? Seemed like a no brainer to stay at Seattle U. I know San Luis Obispo is gorgeous, but I can’t think of many more places I’d like to try and put a program on the map than Seattle.
Why is Seattle U on FSN and not WSU
You would think they would rather have the Pac-10 team over the 2nd year D-1 school. Is it because we are playing IPFW?
by spokanecougar on Nov 19, 2009 7:29 PM PST up reply actions
Cheaper to get camera equipment to KeyArena than Pullman
You can always count of FSN — where money is no object!
Just surprised they couldn't find some UW game somewhere to show
or at least rerun some crappy UW game.
by spokanecougar on Nov 19, 2009 7:33 PM PST up reply actions
That's what I mean when I say we'll go as far as he carries us
If he has more than a few nights like this in Pac-10 play, that could be the difference between an 8th place finish and a fourth place finish.
right...
but oregon state, ucla, stanford…all look right in line with us. arizona state didn’t look like world beaters either. just saying it is wide open (or so it seems) especially if klay shoots like this.
Rotation looks to be
Nik off the bench at the 4
Charlie off the bench at the 5
Harthun off the bench at the 2
Thames off the bench at the 1/2
He seems comfortable
I’m glad, I like him
by Couginthepink on Nov 19, 2009 7:34 PM PST up reply actions
looks like his first game for 30 points
…..maybe even 40
by spokanecougar on Nov 19, 2009 7:36 PM PST up reply actions
I'd kind of prefer he did
I’d like to see some of the other guards get a good hard look in a blowout
Good midrange game
And he can get to the bucket. If he can develop a better outside shot he’ll be a good scorer
Like the NBA
There’s a “no-charge zone” under the rim, but they aren’t drawing the circle. Instead its a judgment decision. Knowing pac-10 refs, that’s not a good thing
Touche
That makes sense and God help us with our refs
by Couginthepink on Nov 19, 2009 7:47 PM PST up reply actions
I was about to say we have a young line-up out there...
but then I realized every line up we have is young!
I'd sit out there too if I was shooting that well
The thing I think he’s learning is that when his shots off, to go to the rim and finish or at least draw contact. That added dimension makes him so much tougher to stop
It probably means they are laying off him a little bit to prevent him from driving the lane.
So instead he lights it up from outside.
Which is where you'll see the difference this year, hopefully
Instead of living outside the arc like last year, he has that added dimension that defenders have to think about. They can’t play tight or he drives, if they lay off he lets it rain
This year Klay learns how to drive
Next year he learns how to post up. Once he gets driving and posting up down, he will as the late Master Po of the old Kung Fu televisions series said, “you will have learned.”
Halftime thoughts from Friel
Horrible job on the boards… that kind of stuff will get us murdered in conference
Offense looks lost without Klay but oh my god Klay is awesome
Like what Thames is doing off the bench. Abe and harthun still can’t buy a bucket
Ipfw missed some wide open shots, but have also made some well defended ones. Still, cougs should be up by more. Got complacent at the end when klay was sitting.
I really wish watson had any shred of body control out there.
Overall not a great half, but not a bad one either thanks to klay. We need to get to the line more.
by Grady Clapp on Nov 19, 2009 7:56 PM PST via mobile reply actions
Isn't he 1-1 this game?
I think his problem this year will likely be that he isn’t big enough for his position. I like him out there so far this year though. Seems to be playing much smarter.
Nevermind
Thought you said Nik. Totally agree on Abe.
Agree with Nik
He’s looking good, taking smart shots, slashing again, and defending well.
He’s a guy I always want to root for
Still closer than it should be
Great night by Klay, but our defense continues to suspect at best.
Shooting
We’re shooting 58% from the field, 60% from 3, and 89% from the line.
I’ll take those numbers
Bud made it sound like
he tripped out of bounds.
wha???
He is really struggling.
He won’t play much in any Pac 10 games if he doesn’t pick up his play quite a bit.
looks waaaaay more athletic than enquist tho
I hope he shreds the early goofiness
by Grady Clapp on Nov 19, 2009 8:35 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
good thing Klay went off tonight
Without him, this is a fairly close game. Still very unimpressed by the defense, but a win is a win. Good job cougs, but we need better defense asap.
I hate to tell you this
But you’re not gonna see great sustained defense like the Bennett system. What you will see is sporadic defense that we turn on when we need to and can fall back to it at times.
You can’t run the Bone offense with it’s emphasis on running and scoring while also playing Bennett level deal
I'd just like to see us stop allowing the layup fests...
that we are seeing other teams experience against us.
I realize this is related to poor rebounding…but we have to fix the rebounding issue or the relatively weak Pac-10 will still eat us alive.
by westsidecougar1 on Nov 19, 2009 8:59 PM PST up reply actions
The offensive rebounding issue is probably a simple fix
We’re selling out for the big swat and leaving the boards open. Fix this and the layup fests will slow. We also gave up a TON of long rebounds today, too. IPFW actually hit alot of contested and tough shots today.
It’s early and they’re still trying to learn the ins and outs of whats expected of them on offense and on defense. The pac-10 is a long way off and the young team you see now has alot of learning to do before then. It’ll come
We better brace for a ...
tough season.
As I feared, we are not committed to playing good team defense.
This is “UW East” without the good rebounding. Very unfortunate.
by westsidecougar1 on Nov 19, 2009 8:57 PM PST reply actions
Relax, it's early
The sky isn’t falling yet. We’re taking care of business and finding an identity. The days of shutdown defense for 40 minutes are gone. Don’t be afraid of change.
If you didn’t see this coming, you didn’t watch the Bone system that took UW deep into the tournament years back. It works
Sure...UW went deep into the tourney....
but I have to say I’m not a fan of that style.
Sloppy play…lackluster defense…undisciplined play.
I’m not afraid of change. I am afraid of lack of mental toughness…which poor defense reflects in my opinion.
The system works with great athletes and 4 star recruits. We will be hard-pressed to recruit that well.
by westsidecougar1 on Nov 19, 2009 9:02 PM PST up reply actions
Nobody, including Bone, likes lackluster, undisciplined, sloppy play
I don’t think mental toughness is an issue here. I do think these guys are still growing into the system and that they will get it. Remember, these are young kids and they’re going to screw up. Bennett’s original boys didn’t have it at first but as they grew and got more comfortable great things happened.
The system can work and we’re getting better athletes all the time. And yes, again, it is still way too early to truly judge the team or how well it works here.
I understand...
I also have seen Bone’s teams play before. He may have won, but I’m not convinced he can do it at WSU. We will see.
Rebounding is about mental toughness.
Even though he kept Ben Johnson, I’m disappointed that we’ve lost our defensive ability so quickly.
We need to be a very tough defensive team first.
Just think if a team can place a high skill defender on Klay. There goes 40% of our points right there. Defense always is there though…and that is why I’m disappointed that we have gone away from that philosophy.
by westsidecougar1 on Nov 19, 2009 9:17 PM PST up reply actions
Westside, correct me if I am wrong
But, aren’t you one of Wulff’s supporters? Why do you support Wulff who has not yet proven he can win at a BCS level and yet not support Bone who has actually proven he can win at every level he has coached, including D1.
Does Bone get to have his recruits to see if his system will work at WSU?
I grew to love Bennett Ball.
But I also realize this will be different. Knowing to take the 83 point scored for games with the 70 allowed is part of the coaching change. This year will be frustrating at times, terribly fun at others. All part of the package.
the Husky entire philosophy hinges on press D and rebounding ....
… not sure where the “lackluster defense” notion comes from. In fact, I’d be hard pressed to find a better on the ball defender in the entire conference than Venoy Overton.
Damn, my eyeball tastes good.
Oh, geez
Don’t start with the Overton thing again … ;-)
I think the notion that Washington is a bad defensive team is based on inaccurate perceptions. It’s just a different style — one that’s much more esoteric and much less concrete, if that makes any sense.
This is kind of what I was driving at with my Bone post last Friday. I think we’re going to go through a little bit of an identity crisis over the next couple of season.
by Jeff Nusser on Nov 19, 2009 10:47 PM PST up reply actions
you think?
I dunno. I think kids adjust fast. Bennett got the Cougs on the map by playing the only style that he could with the talent he had. Now you have better players who can compete. Bone’s philosophy loosens the reigns and lets your young studs be who they were meant to be.
PS – I didn’t know there was a Venoy thing before. I’ll tread lightly.
Damn, my eyeball tastes good.
I'm not talking about the kids adjusting. They'll be fine.
I’m talking about the fans. They’re going to have a tough time embracing this, even if it results in wins. We’ve had “defense first” drilled into our heads for six years. Even in victory, there’s going to be a segment of the fans that are going to constantly be waiting for the other shoe to drop. I suppose that’s a testament to the Bennetts and their philosophy being so heavily dependent on process. Fans are real skeptical that Bone’s process is going to last right now.
Oh, and if you want t read up on the Overton thing …
http://www.cougcenter.com/2009/10/28/1105490/quincy-pondexter-is-sort-of-smart
Not at all
And it hasn’t been for quite a while. It just depends on ending possessions in ways Coug fans aren’t used to. Under the Bennetts, a successful defensive possession was one missed shot followed by a defensive rebound shortly thereafter. Washington predicates it on ending its fair share of possessions with turnovers. Nothing wrong with that.
Even more than that
It’s about guard pressure forcing teams to play to the UW’s tempo, which generally leads to poor shot selection. Turnovers are great, but the Huskies aren’t all that impressive at forcing them.
I guess you're right
They haven’t been a team real good at forcing turnovers since 2006. I also think a huge part of why they’ve been so good is because they’ve been one of the best in the country for the last four years at limiting other teams’ offensive rebounds (perhaps the most underrated part of playing good defense).
I wonder why? :-)
Seriously, though — now that Brockman’s gone, I question whether the defense will be nearly as good. I am not impressed with your frontcourt’s ability to rebound. (Although Breshers might yet prove to be that guy.)
I think that's why they are still recruiting
Adden Aden and probably still not done. I don’t know if we have the players to get too far away from the Bennett system yet. Actually, I know we don’t have the players.
It’s still early though.
Just got done watching Seattle U
That was a hell of a game. I have a feeling I’m going to enjoy following that program — they’re not the Huskies, and they’re trying to catch up to Gonzaga. Seems perfect to me.
Yeah, they are kind of an underdog program
So, I think they moved up to my second favorite program in the state right now. From what I remember, SU wanted to see if they can join the WCC, but Gonzaga was one of the schools that nixed that. They don’t want the competition, because SU could become a sleeping giant.
And if they're successful
We’ll have even less success recruiting the Seattle area! Yay!
I think when it comes to innercity Seattle basketball, the Sonics need to come back. Yesterday.
I believe more accurately it's
Coached by a Bruin and led by a guy who was recruited by Washington, but could not get into the university.
by Jeff Nusser on Nov 19, 2009 10:49 PM PST up reply actions
Dollar's not exactly the most popular coach in Washington
Holy crap, I didn’t realize he inbounded the ball on the Tyus Edney play. That’s sweet.
by Brian Floyd on Nov 19, 2009 10:51 PM PST up reply actions
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